Postgame Thread: Gonzaga routed by Saint Mary's
by Zach Bell on Jan 12, 2012 10:14 PM PST
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PrintCalling tonight a blowout may not do it justice. Saint Mary's put together in incredible performance tonight in an absolute domination of Gonzaga. Matt Dellavedova led the way with 26 points on 10-16 from the floor and was sensational all night long. The Zags did their best to stick with him and Gary Bell had moments of quality defense but the Gaels were able to find him coming off screens and he buried the Bulldogs. Dellavedova wasn't the only player to dominate the Zags and, no, his name is not Rob Jones. Brad Waldow, the Gaels freshman center absolutely ransacked the Bulldogs post players scoring 17 points on 6-8 from the floor. He is obviously extremely raw but has a great feel around the rim and made a number of impressive plays, particularly on the boards and with putbacks.
Here are a few quick thoughts late in the evening...
1) Rob Sacre has had some inept offensive games (quite a few, actually) but tonight was just an evening full of facepalms. In a game when the Zags had a clear size advantage, Rob played two feet shorter than his true height tonight. If the thumb injury is that big of an issue, than he can't be out there because he wasn't doing anything tonight on either end.
2) Elias Harris was the one Zag played with the requisite amount of "pissed-offness" in this game. He was sensational but far too often, the gameplan goes away from him and he gets stretches where he doesn't get touches. When he gets off to such a promising start, the staff can't allow him to get lost out there.
3) The old cliche is that road teams can't be error prone on the road. Looking at simple stats, it is easy to see why this was a major rout. 12 turnovers unofficially, 11-18 from the free throw line and a number of defensive lapses. Aside from Harris and Kevin Pangos, there was not really anything to point to with a positive spin.
4) Pushing the panic button is still premature. Tonight was a filled with unfortunate events and while they were mostly self-induced, there has to be a ton of credit given to SMC. We all know Gonzaga is a far better team than this but with so many young contributors, some hiccups will happen. The key is that the vets have to be more consistent.
Feel free to vent here but as always, keep it classy.
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Got manhandled
not gonna deny it. SMC was the better team tonight. I was shocked, stunned, and mad as hell…but they had a great game plan and executed it perfectly. We got out coached, our performed, and out hustled. Gotta tip your cap and start making adjustments for round II in Spokane.
However, I will rant on the SMC fans. Really? storming the court? I mean I guess it’s ok but all it does is affirm that Gonzaga is your big brother. Duke doesn’t storm the court when they beat UNC. Kentucky doesn’t storm the court when they beat Louisville. You can’t claim to be equals atop a conference with Gonzaga then storm the court when you beat said team. I guess that’s what you get when Gonzaga is your only big win year in and year out. If they want to make it to the tourney they better hope they put forth another one of these performances in the championship game in Vegas.
One more thing, loved that 3 they took when the shot clock was off, then the 2 on 1 missed layup. Such class.
Why don't we compete?
Your comments are quite positive given the results of tonight’s game. We do have some young players, so occasional losses are to be expected. My problem with the Zags for the last few years has been a lack of competitive fire. The players don’t seem to get pissed when they are losing. React, do something. You might still lose, but at least you can say that you gave your best effort to the end. Would Morrison have played like this?
Are these issues with the players, the coaches, or both? Many posters have said that we can correct these issues, just give it time. How long should we wait to see better performances? It isn’t always easy being a fan, but the last few years have been very particularly difficult.
Honestly,
I think we get too fired up. When Harris gets into the heat of the moment, he forces too many shots. Pangos is pretty fiery IMO. I’d rather we make gimmes around the hoop.
Perhaps
I actually respectfully disagree, but even if it were true I’d take it. Many great coaches have taught me that they would always prefer players that play hard (even if they have to dial it back at times) over ones that they have to “motivate.”
coach few
Needs to pull his head of his ass. His rotations are terrible. DS and Hart killed us tonight. Yet one starts and the other gets way too much playing time. Few constantly kills momentum by playing too many people and not to mention the wrong people. We are so much more talented than our foes in this conference yet losses like this are a reflection of what few has become as a coach.
by montanazag on Jan 12, 2012 11:00 PM PST via mobile reply actions
Agree, in part
I think Few made so many substitutes so early because he was searching for the right combo defensively. It’s too bad that that never happened. One thing that puzzled me was when he went to a short line up in the middle of the second half. For a while, Harris was the tallest guy out there. The Gaels out played us in the paint. I wouldn’t go so far as to say he had his head in his ass, though.
"We are so much more talented than our foes in this conference..."
Mouthpiece, Holt, Page, Jones, Waldow (Bennett) >>> Pangos, Bell, Hart, Harris, Sacre (Few)…
The Zags are just starting to see the true talent of Stephen Holt. And Babyfat Waldow just had his breakout moment in the conference (The freshman has been pretty consistent over the past 10 games). The Gaels outclassed the Zags w/ talent last night. And they did it with one Senior who scored 2pts (Jones).
by Colorado Fan on Jan 13, 2012 7:57 AM PST up reply actions
Agree with Colorado
I think SMC has more talent in their starting lineup. Very hard to defend them.
No D Tonight!
There were so many factors tonight on why we got handled like a bunch of sally’s…looked like we didnt belong in the same gym tonight. I would of accepted the loss if we played competititve tonight and made it a game, young team @ St Mary’s, tough crowd I expected this game to be down to the wire. We didnt compete on the defensive end and we let a freshman handle us down low for 17 pts! just ridiculous.
Every time we made a shot SM answered each time, we had no run, and had a large number of ill advised turnovers, just lazy passes.
What scares me is that they beat us w/out Jones tonight, they are deeper than I think most of us thought. They move the ball well, they forced us to take bad shots, and on an on and on.
I hate the fact that we were routed on national television! I wish I could hibernate until we can return the favor when they come to the kennel in FEB.
They deserve the credit, the played great tonight, we didnt.
JSH
by scotthen49 on Jan 12, 2012 11:04 PM PST reply actions 1 recs
I personally disagree....Mouth Piece is the only quality player on the entire team....
they killed us because their coach has a much better game plan…..the freshmen guy that scored 17 never made any kind of moves it was always one of the guards that would make a move draw the fresman’s defender and then he was standing under the basket wide open with the ball. He did absolutely nothing but just catch and jump up to the rim.
Sacre & Dower- 2/11 shooting....GAME.
Only forced St. Mary’s into 5 turnovers while we had 12.
Last year we had one of the best front lines in the country. This year an even better one. Pfffffffft.
Wonder if Bennett is high fiving the players hucking up 3s in the last 35 seconds when they were up 21? Pathetic!
This did not happen, did it?
Final 4 or Bust!!~
Dower
Easy to scout his tendencies, i.e. always goes left. He is a weak rebounder/defender as well. If he played both ends of the court, he would get more minutes.
This was just a bad effort
Zags weren’t in the game mentally. SMC/Dellavedova played perfectly, and we were about as bad as I’ve ever seen. I think we got demoralized in the second half when another SMC air ball turned into an offensive rebound and points. We played some good defense at times and just couldn’t snag a rebound.
Harris played well, Pangos was OK, but for the most part the effort just wasn’t there. Not a well coached game, but on a night where his players didn’t show up I can’t really blame Few. SMC has been waiting for this one all year, and their strategy of getting into tourney contention by having a weak body of work with exactly one win over Gonzaga will succeed again.
It was just one of those nights, we were lethargic and played horrible while our rival played to their full capability on their home court. Hopefully this loss makes the team improve. SMC is a good game for us because they are built around beating GU, so they exploit every weakness we show until we play them each year. It was nice to see that Rob Jones was really overrated…
Welcome to the Sound Pound...
Second Point
You are spot on with your second point. Harris is the teams best player and biggest threat. He can hit from outside and take his defender to the hole. It drives me absolutely crazy when there are big stretches of the game and he doesn’t even touch the ball unless he gets a rebound. He is also the post with the best vision (i.e. makes the right pass) and can find Pangos for open shots. I think the offense NEEDS to go through Harris if the Zags are going to make a run this year.
Interesting...
Just watching the news, and apparently this is the worse loss in conference place as far as deficit since 1992.
Im fueling my own fire
We were in a worse position last year when we had 3 losses in a row, we had a great run to share the title. Our road is a lot tougher now after tonights loss, with a little bit of help from the rest of the league and for us to hold home court and to go the BYU and win we will be ok…
Hopefully after a cpl weeks I will be over this loss!
JSH
Beat like a drum
The took Jones out completely just like I thought. Dellavadova made up for it in spades.
Well . . . looks like SMC is in the driver’s seat.
mjc
No Rebounding
SMC always had 2-3 guys around the rim — often we had no one in that part of the country when we took a shot. That has to change.
mjc
The ESPN announcers
said that Sacre was clearly not playing as good as he can. They made one comment that stuck with me. They said that Sacre wasn’t powering up to the basket – not jumping as high as he is able. They said it was plainly a loss of confidence. I hope not.
The WCC isn't over yet. SMC is yet to convince me they're gonna roll thorugh the WCC road tests.
Even though they’ve killed us and BYU at home, SMC is a team that has only played FOUR true road games all year – including a loss at Denver and only beating Cal Poly and San Diego by 5 and 6 respectively.
SMC vs who?
Who was that team that played SMC last night? It certainly wasn’t the team that I saw play/beat Xavier…I can’t say the crowd wasn’t a factor, but that venue doesn’t seem that intimidating – looks more like my old high school gym. It just didn’t seem like the Zags showed up to play their biggest rivalry on their turf. I can only hope the 6th man in the McCarthey Center shows up Feb 9 and gives the Gaels a taste of their own medicine. Is it just me or does anyone else cringe when the guys come out in those black uniforms?
I made the
same comment to my wife last night about the uniforms. Speaking of 6th men,for a while until Sacre heals I think Few should start Sacre let him play a couple of minutes, then hand it off to Dower and leave it that way for the rest of the game. Pangos has a knack of finding Dower open. They should play to their strengths. The lob to Harris to start the game was one of the best plays.
Imagine your high school gym...
…stuffed to the rafters and out into the hall and entryways with extremely loud fans. I went to the NIT first round game when they played WSU and I had to literaly trip over Casto, Klay Thompson, and Taylor Rochestie to get to our seats right behind the Cougar bench. The fans are right on top of the court and bench. The screaming, “Aussie, Aussie, Aussie” chants (so annoying) and sound system blaring Men at Work’s “Land Down Under” during timeouts (exponentially MORE annoying) is ear-splitting if not mind-numbing. And that was a game they were disappointed to be playing in. Make no mistake: that barn is a HUGE home-court advantage. At least they finally fixed the lighting so it isn’t like watching “Hoosiers” or an amish league game by candlelight anymore.
JV vs Varsity
Coaches and players out there- 2nd or 3rd time this year that it felt like we were the JV going against the varsity. You think you have at least as much skill as the big boys do until you are actually on the floor and you realize that they are just able to shove you around and do what they want to with you. I hate this saying because it’s pretty “inane”, but it is what it is.
IMO the last few seasons we keep getting “surprised” when a team sort of manhandles us: UNC, Syracuse, BYU, last night-SMC. I think we should talk about how we can overcome these lapses or figure out a way to counteract it. If last night was a prize fight, we were KOd early. Even when it was close, it was just a matter of time. In the “olden days” I never felt that GU was weaker than our opponents, maybe just not quite as talented. Even in the Matt Bouldin days you could feel him get pushed around a bit. Remember when Heyfelt dominated Tyler Hansbrough. When we lost that heartbreaker to UConn, we were standing toe to toe with them in the middle of the ring.
IMO, if we are going to get over this hump we need to buy into a style of play that is totally unique, that takes advantage of our strengths, and forces the opponents to have to adjust to us. ( Yes, I do worship at the altar of Paul Westhead/LMU/Guru of Go.) Full court, helter/skelter, open floor, pressing, baseball passes, dunks, 3s, rebounding, trapping. Whew- sorry guys- I’m like a junkie getting a fix. Long story short- play to our strengths, not our opponents. Use our team depth, athleticism and skills of our bigs, hide the inexperience of our guards and let them play loose. Harris can be our Hank Gathers. Tell Sacre to sprint to the blocks and don’t move- look for put backs and dunks- you are not allowed to force anything- we will make you a star by picking up garbage hoops and bounds.
Dellavadova- he’s that older, cagey guy at the YMCA that kicks everyone’s butt. He gets ahead of you by an inch and then uses his muscle to make a play. Awkward shooter, only needs an inch. If it’s me, I don’t let him get close to me. You can’t hit something that you can’t catch. Go Zags- run the table, then face them again with home-cooking.
My head is down for the ZAGS
SM wanted this game so bad, they all but couldn’tt help themselves. To kleep launching 3’s and more points up until the last seconds of the game. Few needs to motivate around this. And shame on Randy Bennett, for letting his team look very high school at the end……….
100% agreed
No issue with the loss. Saint Mary’s couldn’t miss and we couldn’t make anything. They outplayed us and it showed. What I did have an issue with was Bennett keeping the starters in until the last minute and allowing his team to try and run up the score. That is classless. I never remember the zags pulling a stunt like that when they are up by 20.
by carpsalad2000 on Jan 13, 2012 7:30 AM PST up reply actions
I have no problem with the way St. Mary's handled clock management at the end...
It just goes to prove this game means the world to St. Mary’s. They so badly wanted to take it to the Zags and were willing to show no mercy in doing so. After all, this is supposedly our biggest rival, right? The hatred between the two just stepped up a notch. Was it classless? ABSOLUTELY! I’m not calling anyone out, but to hammer this particular topic after a loss is like complaining about the officiating. They’re are so many other glaring issues to address heading into this weekend’s game.
I just hope Few and Co. remember the way the game ended and are able to use it as motivation come Feb. 9th. Payback is a beezy.
by superZAGnics on Jan 13, 2012 8:36 AM PST up reply actions 1 recs
Simply stated that playing like this is a busch league move. I have no complaints with the loss or officiating or how we were completely dominated on both ends. We got whooped fair and square. The only issue I take offense to is running up the score with starters as opposed to burning the clock with a 20 point lead. I have never seen us do this and rarely in any team sport do you see any team pull this. If they do their coach is ridiculed all over sportscenter. Rivalry game – yes. They were better – yes. Complete lack of class in a win – yes.
I guarantee you if we happen to get up big on them in spokane with a couple minutes left Few would never pull that. No matter how badly you want to beat somebody there is a line you do not cross when you do so. Bennett allowed his team to cross that line of kicking a downed man. Shame on them for that but congrats on a solid win that they earned.
by carpsalad2000 on Jan 13, 2012 9:05 AM PST up reply actions 1 recs
Agree, but
I wish/hope Few has the balls to return the favor in Spokane. I wanna see an ally oop to Harris as the clock expires to make it a 25 point win. Eye for an eye…
I’m hoping this win will give them the confidence to start working on a tougher schedule than Pepperdine for 2013…
this is exactly what's wrong with Gonzaga teams year in and year out...No ruthlessness
what is this nice guy bullshit? This is a game played amongst grown men, you play to the final whistle, and you keep playing your game until the other team stops you or the final whistle blows. there’s no crying or whining and saying “oh we’re up 20, better put in the second team”…thats total BS. Good for Saint Mary’s, they wanted it more and they took it to us, it wasn’t running up the score, they were playing the #23 team in the nation.
I disagree
This isn’t a pick up game, this is college hoops. In basketball and all sports in general winning should come first. Period. But 2nd on that list is respect. Respecting the game and the other team as well. St. Mary’s had won the game with 2 minutes left, no doubt about it. Why huck up a 3 with the shot clock off THEN try to score on a transition basket? Did it help you win the game? No. Let the clock expire, shake their hands, then go party and celebrate a well-earned win.
So you do or don't want Few to return the favor?
As opposed to an eye for an eye, I would rather have the opportunity AND see the Zags to look like the better/classier team on national television; make the subs and hold for the clock.
Again, I can understand and see why St. Mary’s would do otherwise (reasons as stated by Irish Zag in addition to it being your hated rival) and I love the fact that they did. It ante ups the rivalry and helps distinguish between good vs. evil for the rest of the country because yes, carpsalad, I too guarantee Few would never do the same in Spokane.
by superZAGnics on Jan 13, 2012 4:29 PM PST up reply actions
Sorry I reread my posts and realize they may seem confusing
I WANT Few to return the favor in Spokane, but ONLY because St. Mary’s actions yesterday. Normally I believe all teams should run out the clock appropriately.
It’s like baseball, if you let the other team hit your batters without retaliating, you basically let teams walk all over you. Taking a 3 in that situation is like stealing second in the 9th inning when you’re up 12.
Many people on this site have been clamoring for the team and Few to show some “fire” or “passion.” I think returning the favor in Spokane is a great way to do that. It lets SMC know that yeah we saw that, and this is what we think of it.
False
Tim Williams shot a 3-pointer with 45 seconds remaining in the game. The shot clock was at 33 seconds. Sore loser syndrome.
by Colorado Fan on Jan 14, 2012 10:27 AM PST up reply actions
And...
Marquise Carter hit a 3-pointer after Tim Williams banked one in… Why didn’t you guys just quit?
by Colorado Fan on Jan 14, 2012 10:29 AM PST up reply actions
We don't quit.
If you watch any basketball at all, you know that when teams are up big at the end of games, respectable teams with the lead back it off. We always do it.
And, teams that are obviously defeated try to score so they can feel like they took something positive out of the loss.
WHY am I even trying to explain this to you?…It’s called RESPECT for your opponent…obviously, St. Mary’s has none.
Final 4 or Bust!!~
I hate this argument, whenever I see it.
I follow the simple comeback, “well stop them then”. Think about this answer- why don’t we just stop the games then. Like in boxing, when the towel is thrown in. TKO
I was an end-of-the bench guy on my college team. I lived for “turkey time”. My college coach would actually call timeouts during turkey time to pull us together. I will forever respect him for caring enough about us and the game to bother to do this. Do you put your bench guys in, so they can hold the ball at half court?
I also have experience with this thing as a high school coach. A lopsided game is one of the hardest things to manage as a coach, assuming you are not going to just hold the ball. As a coach, you want your players to play and play in the manner that is characteristic of your squad.
One more point: In a backwards way, St. Mary’s was actually showing us respect with how they behaved. They showed us what GU means to them. Doesn’t mean we shouldn’t give it back to them at our place.
We can stop crying any time now, regroup, get better, and hand it to them in the rematch.
And in the rematch, when we get up by 40
with less than 30 seconds to go, we will show them how much we “respect” them by having our turkey gobblers hucking up threes.
Sorry, but I am not going to agree with you on this one. It is plain ol disrespectful allowing your subs to play like that. If coach Few ever allowed that I wouldn’t be very pleased….but we don’t have to worry, because he never will!
Final 4 or Bust!!~
Gaz
I coached against some (****’*) like that in High School. They are far and few between, and thats a good thing.
Ditto!
tanxs man.
I was thinbking am I going crazy here arguing this point? That MD dude is whack! lol
Final 4 or Bust!!~
False
Well Williams did make a 3pointer with 45 seconds left. Don’t have a problem with that. Then Carter made one with 40 seconds left. THEN Page missed a 3 with under 35 to play and the shot clock off. Hart got the rebound, passed it to Stockton, Page stole it from Stockton and ran a 2 on 1 against Hart with Petrulis who missed a layup with 5 seconds left.
The Gaels had not one, but TWO chances to run out the clock and chose not to do so either time.
And I guess you would know all about sore loser syndrome, you experience it way more often than I do.
thanks for the correct recap.
I missed the mark in my above comment…I meant to say, What St. Mary’s is lacking….is CLASS.
Final 4 or Bust!!~
Incorrect
If the Gaels get waxed, I try to figure out why that happened…
So, in the 12+ years of wcc titles, the zags never tried to get some pts for the 13th man on the bench? Wil Foster begs to differ.
by Colorado Fan on Jan 14, 2012 2:49 PM PST up reply actions
Not when they can run the clock out to end the game.
Please prove to me otherwise.
by superZAGnics on Jan 14, 2012 3:45 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
Exactly
I don’t have a problem if whoever on the Gaels wanted to jack up 3s if the shot clock is on. I’ve never seen any Zags team do that against any team, even SMC.
It’s pretty rare to find any NCAA team that will do that
I agree with Irish Zag
College basketball is a competitive sport and every game counts. They have to run up the score in a game like that if they want any chance to be considered outside of an automatic bid. The only reason I’m glad we don’t do this is avoiding injuries to key players in a game that’s already won. One of the smarter things Few does.
So, ending a game...
With one “starter” on the floor (Jorden Page) is running up the score? You guys have been putting a beating on teams for the past 15 years. Take your medicine.
by Colorado Fan on Jan 14, 2012 10:26 AM PST up reply actions
Sure, and keep celebrating..
you really know we will atone at home, and progress much further in Tourney, if you even get there…I know you know this, because you are smart enough to spell a couple words..
Oh he's just cheesed because everytime his team gets looking like they have a pair...they collapse.
We have been winning with class all these years. How could he understand that. His team is pretty new to the spotlight and I spose “class” does not come natural to his thinking process. It does not compute….sad, really.
Final 4 or Bust!!~
by gaz-tastic on Jan 14, 2012 12:14 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
A few points
Why were we playing zone at the end of the game? St. Mary’s last night really played excellent defense the whole game. On the other hand what was Gonzaga doing? First time all season I remember where we were unable to switch screens. Hedging was horrible. Pick and roll worked for them over and over. So many times Stockton or Pangos caught down low guarding a big, allowing St. Mary’s other open looks. No help on Holt’s drives (always right). No boxing out.
Out rebounded
poor foul shooting, the inability to defend the pick and role (and their ability to do so) and the fact they couldn’t miss. I doubt they have a better shooting night the rest of the season.
"Average is as Average does"
Saint Mary's shot
50.8% for the game. That’s good, but not awesome. Their average is 48.4%. They hit 36% beyond the arc, which is about their average.
The difference in the game is the defense, or lack thereof. Zags still get suckered into over-shifting from the help side leaving them an open look on the perimeter. The Zags didn’t defend as aggressively coming off the screens as they have been. It seems our defense just rolled over.
On-ball screen
Hopefully the Zags can figure out how to guard the on-ball screen next time. They ran the pick and roll on almost every play…and it worked on almost every play. The help defense needs to be more effective so we dont lose guys on the roll.
This
We stop the pick and roll, we win that game. They were gonna keep running it until we could stop it…and we never did
seriously
I cant remember a play where St. Mary’s didn’t use it, unless it an uptempo scenario. I can guarantee Few will come up with a plan to stop it, but judging be geicos APG many teams have tried to stop it and failed.
St Mary's
Runs that offense 90% of the time to everyone. They do it every year. Why didn’t Few teach them 3-4 years ago?
by Colorado Fan on Jan 14, 2012 10:31 AM PST up reply actions
you really are not worth the effort...
but I am not going to let this one go….mostly because you seem to state you are a SMC fan or at least appear to be one…but then you go and say this? Actually this is the first time in 3 years SMC has run this offense. And do you know why?
Actually I would LOVE for you to break down their offensive sets for me. Tell me/us…what they do and how they translate this into scoring opportunities. Please do. Enlighten us all…..
If you don't like my fire then don't come around...
Just a few thoughts.
Why were we playing a laid back zone with 4-5 minutes left in the game down +15? Thought we were playing that zone lazily, and let them run down the clock and shoot 3’s near the end of the shotclock. Great time management by SMC.
Sacre was pretty soft tonight, but we’ve always known that. I think he’s an easy escape-goat for this game because he played so horrid, but I think he’ll be fine and back to “normal” for what that’s worth.
Clearly, Pangos is our only gamer. This guy knows how to make plays and come and play. I saw someone post earlier about “pissed-offness” – I agree with that, I think its more “poise” to me, and just being able to perform even in big games.
M. Carter. We need you. He came into the game and had a nice driving layup, I thought he was going to come out aggressive and get out of his funk. He’s got to be a factor for us coming off the bench. Where are you? :(
I like Dower offensively, but he is sorely lacking and hurting us on the defensive end.
This is off topic, and alludes to another thread, but…do you know what Khem Birch would have done to Where’s Waldow? C’mon!
SMH, tough loss, but props to SMC for taking it to us. Looking forward to the Zags bouncing back
The Zone
Going to the zone-D near the end of the game was a total and complete concession by Few. Tactically, it made absolutely no sense—to me, at least. And Few has done this before—can’t remember the game exactly, but I am pretty sure we were down and then lost; so I guess either Illinois or MSU. Back to the point, does anyone really have some insight that could enlighten us (me) on the school of thought that leads to a late game zone-D against a good, and often live-and-die-by-the-three team? Don’t we need points, quickly and efficiently? Don’t we need every last second of that clock? Why are we wasting minutes and giving the other team, a good three point shooting team at that, the only option for points, a three pointer?….It’s a mood point, and I don’t want to dwell on it too much, but it is infuriating and a reason I question Few’s decision making at times. Because I really don’t have a problem with the zone-D or how we play it. In fact, I think it was almost too good last night. We slowed their offense down and made them take deep threes. They had a comfortable lead at home and said, “Yeah, sure. We’re OK with slowing the game down and shooting some threes. This is something we can get behind!”
Moving on, the team seemed to play with a nervous tentativeness, and Mouthpiece (I like this nickname) totally exploited our lack of composure with some simple penetration. Our defense for most of the night included a lot of head turning and arm flailing, and not a lot of body movement. Bell Jr. was fantastic on D, I believe he got a body-checking foul and a reach-in foul that were both contentious—in my opinion, and although his stat line wasn’t great—3 TO, I thought his composure was fantastic. Speaking of composure, Pangos is the man. Nothing more needs to be said about Pangos; he’s our Moses and we must follow him. Harris, on the other hand, could not be more infuriating. His "pissed-offness", as many others have said, was nice to see. But, like delro1 said, I think “poise” or “composure” is what’s needed more in games like last nights. The rate at which Harris turns the ball over is stupid. He’s credited with 4 TO, but his shot selection — of often times forcing it between 2 to 3 defenders — is absolutely horrendous and is basically like a turnover.
The Zags are a rhythm team; our rhythm was thrown last night. We need composure from our juniors and seniors, who have been there before, to beat the drum and set our rhythm; our juniors and seniors did not show composure and our rhythm was thrown. Basically, SMC threw off our groove! And then they threw us out the window!
Well that was a mess of thoughts. I suppose I didn’t have to reply to delro1, but whatever.
All good points
Yeah I’m dumbfounded by the as are many others. Maybe Few feels it’s easier to drop into a zone after full court press? I dunno, I’ve liked the way we’ve played zone against teams that can’t shoot well from outside (Xavier most recently comes to mind). But against SMC, the zone would literally be THE LAST thing that would slow them down. Dellavedova & Steindl are totally content taking 3s from Telegraph Ave if they have to.
A piece of advice.....certainly not meant for all. Seriously!
I’m suggesting to those who really are interested in WHY GU lost and how they can and will rebound, to do the following: First, put aside the EMOTION. Next, if you are as some express to be here,understanding the game of hoops, take a shot of actually breaking down the game. By that, I mean completly from start to finish. Obviously, if you didn’t tape it, you can’t. If you actually do those simple tasks of shedding the emotion and fairly reviewing the game you will certainly become more adept at your comments overall referring to the game of hoops and might really enjoy it! That would be just the basics.
If your passionate about the WHY, the task of breaking down the game becomes quite arduous. To me, that is like smoking a fine cigar and topping it off with a glass of Louis Tre Cognac! I’m not patronizing anybody here. Just suggesting for some of you who might like a better understanding of the game, is to do your own scouting report. If you had the basics of the game plan to go hand in hand with your own report, that would be iceing on the cake!
For those who give a rats ass about any of that, it is what it is! I would suggest that the more educated anyone can be about the subject they’re discussing allows for a stronger position in that debate, thats all!
Reading many of the posts with enthusiasm, I think most of their comments or questions would be answered by their own effort. That would actually make for a more solid discussion about each game.
As I said up top, this piece of advise is only for some so don’t get upset if you don’t fit into conversation! As always, opinions are just that, as is mine.
by mikesequim on Jan 13, 2012 9:53 AM PST reply actions 4 recs
lets here your words of wisdom mike
Obviously you have given yourself the label of a basketball educator on this site. As Zach said “go ahead and vent”. Most of us on this site are passionate fans and yes we do get emotional when we loose, but please don’t try and play that level headed break down game film crap. You mike have bashed few countless times with really no insight whatsoever. Please don’t jump on the band wagon and try to pull that “leave emotion crap out of it” what else is there?
by montanazag on Jan 13, 2012 6:17 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
My opinion of last nights game
Zags sucked. St. Mary’s was good.
We couldn’t make shots 3 feet from the basket (albeit with contact). St. Mary’s couldn’t miss from inside 40 ft.
Zags shot themselves in the foot with unforced turnovers everytime we were poised to make a run, we never got momentum and it was mostly our own fault. St. Mary’s capitalized on every mistake we made with good ball movment and great shooting.
Zags defense was standoffish, we switched too many ball screens, and didn’t provide the kind of pressure we have seen the previous 8 games. St. Mary’s was the aggressor on defense all night and corraled more rebounds without even being challenged.
Zags played a 2-3 zone (I’ll assume it was to stop dribble penetration, usually it’s because Few isn’t sure how to stop the opposing offense) . St. Mary’s still drove right down the lane for several mildly contested lay ups.
St. Mary’s seems like a team that is the antithesis of Gonzaga. They’ve been built around our weaknesses, and it’s obvious they were preparing for this game long before we were. It’s frustrating to see them continually play such a weak schedule, as it makes beating us or winning the WCC (one and the same, usually) their only path to the NCAA tournament. Still, that should continue to make us better as a team, I just wish SMC’s scheduling would pick up to improve the conference as a whole. I have to take my hat off to SMC, they played a near perfect game and the Zags reminded me of the team they were at the beginning of last year.
That being said, St. Mary’s didn’t do themselves any favors by running the score up at the end of the game or by storming the court afterwards. Zags will be out for blood next time we meet.
Oh, and by the way
SMC blows.
Go Zags.
by rappell40 on Jan 13, 2012 11:52 AM PST up reply actions 1 recs
WCC Refs
I have read this site for a long time but never really post. I am not complaining about the refs, just an observation.
It seems that WCC refs over the years consistantly have let the big men be hammered with no call. The problem is that zags are used to having a lot of those calls when they get hammered in their out of conference schedule. They seem so frustrated and out of sync when they get hammered and get no call. This always seems to be the case when conference play starts. This bodes well for the other team because it takes the zag big men out of their game. Sacre had scored a bunch of his points early in the year from the charity stripe. No call= No stripe=Bad game for the big men.
Last night they got hammered hard several times with no call. They got frustrated, lost focus and had a bad game. Same story every year. They don’t seem to adjust well to the refs.
Not the I think the refs are bad or one sided, just doesn’t seem to work out so well for the big men when they call the game that way. Just one man’s observation.
Disagree
Historically WCC refs call every little thing underneath and not so much on top. Last night they let them play — which is advantage St Mary’s.
mjc
Agree with you
I’ve always thought that WCC refs called every touch, bump, or a lot of the times, call fouls because they figured out the whistle makes a cool sound.
And yeah last night the refs let them play. I wish every WCC game was officiated like that. My biggest complaint with WCC refs is not that they are “refereeing for an upset” but that they are so inconsistent from game to game and even half to half.
I agree that they are inconsistent.
But, if they let them play like that every game, the zags will lose a lot more. The big guys get frustrated and cant play through it. Sacre scores best from the line. Guess we will just have to disagree on the other part.
The reason they get frustrated and can't play through it
is because they are used to them being called fouls. As a player, you don’t really care what is a foul and what isn’t a foul (within reason), but you want it to be called with consistency.
But yeah, I agree that the Zags would probably lose if all of a sudden this switch happened. There would definitely be an adjustment period if we went from say WCC refs to Big East refs every game.
Fantastic picture choice, Zach!
It made me lol.
by ZigZags on Jan 13, 2012 12:52 PM PST reply actions 1 recs
SMC wanted it more plan and simple
The Zags ran into a team that played lights out and out huslted them. Rob and Sam were off no doubt but with about 10 minutes left in the game it was about a 10 point game even though the Zags were playing so poorly they still had a chance to win the game. Then came the zone D and there went the game.
I know E at the 3 didn’t work last year and I’m not saying he should play the 3 a lot…but instead of worrying how to guard SMC (since the Zags were in a zone anyway) why not go with KP, GBJ, E, Sam, Rob line-up? Make SMC match-up with the size. Stinal(sp?) was at the 3 spot for most of the last 10 minutes. whoever he (would be guarding) post him up! Make SMC have to make an adjustment.
Take advantage of your size and lenght, the bigger line-up would have been able to guard more area than a smaller one if nothing else!
I think that's our best lineup
I wish Few would use it more
"Average is as Average does"
With Bouldin
When Gray and Bouldin were our backcourt, that was good. I loved Gray but his game sorta fell apart last year trying to lead the team instead of getting to play the 2 all the time.
Granted, the Zags got demolished. But I feel this is as much a result of having a freshman backcourt and playing a nearly syracuse style nonconference. 2 road games this year before SMC, I don’t think that has ever happened.
Also, SMC’s tournament hopes hang on this game every year. I used to respect them, because they made us look better. But if they’re gonna treat this game like THE GAME, we need to as well. I’m not saying schedule cupcakes like they do, but the fans and the coaches need to start pushing this rivalry. Until that happens, its a fierce rivalry in the gaels eyes, and they’ll always come out playing harder than we will.
Rivalry
This game was voted the best Rivalry in the West Coast (Currently). What other motivation to the Zags need?
by Colorado Fan on Jan 14, 2012 10:41 AM PST up reply actions
By who??? ESPN driven, trying to maximize WCC ratings... REALITY ,,, SMC is not relevant
UCLA vs Arizona, both have been to final fours, won NCAA championships, in the last 20 yrs..
Zags, one of the top 2-3 mid majors of last 15 years… Gaels… riding coattails, trying to be relevant… best rivalry in WCC, yeah, for a few years,,, just like Zags vs. Pepperdine was a few years ago, and Zags vs. ______ in the next few years…HAHAHAHA
We've managed to find motivation
and have shown it by winning soooo many successive WCC Titles and making the dance sooooo many years in a row. We don’t need some fake rivalry with St. Mary’s for motivation.
But, St. Mary’s is motivated because of the cuppycakes you schedule, you NEED to beat us…or it’s NIT time…if you’re lucky.
Matt72 is correct. They only said that to stir up ratings. It’s BS. Get over yourself!
Final 4 or Bust!!~
How's Kelly doing?????
I was really upset at the absence of our bigs against SMC, which makes me think, how the heck has Kelly been progressing in his redshirt year???? Anyone seen him work against Sacre and Dower in practice? Is he quicker and more aggressive and headier??? I like to know because we sure could have used him against SMC as a third option. Frankly, I’m fed up with the job Daniels has done with the bigs, Sacre is reverting to the dud offense of his freshman year and Dower stepped down, way down, in a game he should have been stepping up.
But, no fair to jump Daniels yet.
He has not had enough time yet, remember? Everytime I have brought that up I get slajammered.
I thought it looked like there was some tangible proof that things were on the upswing w/ our bigs because of Daniels, not anymore.
Is he entitled to a “sophomore slump” as a coach too? Nope.
Final 4 or Bust!!~
Rob is in a funk, huge factor
I have a feeling he will snap out of it, as he regains health and confidence. Too strong not to.
Yeah, we didn’t match their effort, were taken out of rhythm offensively, turned it over.. Freshmen backcourt will be inconsistent. Was surprised how good Holt was defensively!
We ARE more talented… next game, at home, when GLE is more solidly oriented in rotation, and more comfortable with his (hopefully) expanded role, I’ll expect us to pay SMC back!
Let's not look past LMU... Ok?
They seem to give us problems at their house every year. Should we win tonight? Of course….but how will we respond after that throttling at SMC?
Tonights game will be very, very, telling. Can’t wait to see what we are made of going forward.
GO ZAGS!!~
Final 4 or Bust!!~
More perimeter shooting...
could’ve helped us offensively. Harris had some serious open looks in that game and passed them up. He’s shot so well from 3 in the stretch leading up to last night, I’m not sure why he was holding back.
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