My Problem with the WCC
by opooos on Aug 24, 2010 4:40 PM PDT
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I admittedly have been a bit obsessed with the conference expansion and conference switching. This whole process has sort of fascinated me (plus it helps that it is the middle of summer I suppose) because there is a real chance that this time around it could affect GU. However I read something today that made me mad (Andy Katz's blog):
"Utah State hasn't reached out to the WCC or the Big West. The WCC has made it clear it is not going to take public colleges or universities because its membership is made up only of church-based private schools. The Big West, according to a source with direct knowledge, has heard only from Hawaii and not the other remaining five WAC schools (Utah State, New Mexico State, Idaho, San Jose State or Louisiana Tech)."
Why are the higher ups purposely limiting the WCC so much? The purpose of these athletic conferences should be to develop student athletes not to keep conference membership the same. What good does it serve the WCC to keep out teams like Utah State and New Mexico State (both teams went to the tournament last year)? Its not like the WCC was founded as a religious conference. Nevada-Reno, UNLV, and SJSU all used to be members of the WCC.
read on for more...
These schools that find themselves between a rock and a hard place would bring in better competition and money into all the member schools thus better increasing the chances that the WCC can develop better student athletes. But now the WCC has limited itself to trying to get BYU (which is a long shot) or staying the course and hoping that the other schools get better and we as GU fans have to keep waiting it out for the other schools in this conference to be consistently better.
I am willing to bet that if Utah State had the chance they would jump from the WAC right now, Hawaii was ready to join the WCC too. Now Utah State has to hope for a MWC invite and Hawaii is looking to the Big West. I firmly believe that whoever is making the decision to keep this a private-christian league is making a huge mistake and it is all the more likely that if given the opportunity GU will jump ship from this conference.
This post does not reflect the views of the blog authors or SB Nation.
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Cynical Me
I’m not going to agree with you or disagree with you.
I think the over riding concern is always going to be $$$$ Which is why Hawaii is not going to be in the WCC.
The next consideration is wear and tear on the Student Athlete. I’ve been there and done that, and I will tell you that a three day road trip (Friday to Sunday — football) doesn’t just mess with your internal clock. It really does affect your ability to do a good job in the class room for a couple days. IMO Basketball has to be worse. I don’t know how they do it (if they are carrying a full load).
Most of the Schools are located in CA. Trips are short and the impact on the players is probably minimal. Now where GU and Portland are concerned that may not be the case but where the others are concerned . . .
Quality of the League is up from 10 years ago. No question. And just getting better all the time — collectively speaking. I was most impressed with Pepperdine’s improvement in 2009/2010 big jump — way to go down there. Grier has had trouble but lets face it, he has yet to put “his” team on the floor — this year may well be the first year we really see a team with his stamp on it. I mean think about it. How many years did you think that Portland would NEVER amount to any thing. They were the bottom of the league and destine to stay there. Always had one good player but never any depth. Then is what . . about two or three years not only did they become relevant, they were considered one of the best, if not the best team in the league. Nope, I will disagree with you here. The League is heading in the right direction and I believe it will continue to improve.
I am with you on the church school thing to a point. There is no need to limit the league to religious institutions. That said, the size of the various institutions is comparable and likely to stay that way. That’s a good thing in my book. I would be leery of bringing in a school that is substantially larger or smaller than the relative mean that we now enjoy.
mjc
I was trying to keep PC with the money thing
I know the point of conferences and the NCAA is supposed to be on Student Athletes but I agree with you on the money thing. It is the number one motivation for these conferences and if the student’s class schedule was really such a concern for the NCAA then there wouldn’t be so much talk of expansion of the post season.
As far as the schools are concerned I don’t see anything wrong with letting different schools in the conference. If the schools are on the same level more or less competition wise then what is wrong with admitting them if they want to join. I am not saying that the WCC should accept all schools that want to come in, but I do want this conference to consider expansion if it benefits the member institutions. That is something I think Hawaii and Utah State would do. Instead we have limited ourselves to the selection of either Seattle U or BYU.
I should also say that I don’t think that this is Jamie Z’s fault entirely. He doesn’t seem (to me at least) to be somebody who is stuck in his ways. He made a very public run at BYU and has made great strides with the WCC’s TV coverage and with our tournament.
I'd love to have NMSU and USU in the WCC
If, of course, we can’t get out of the conference first :)
Thanks for the fanpost…great stuff. Love the opinions.
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Andy Katz is slightly off
I feel that the reason the WCC is not going after state schools is that the conference wants to keep its membership within the same athletic budget demographic. Although the current alignment consists of all Christian schools (with seven of them Catholic, four Jesuit) it is the fact that they all have similar budgets that allows them to form the WCC. (Granted, our budget is higher than the rest, but that is a somewhat new development.)
“Church-based” is a convenient but hollow term. BYU is an LDS school, and, as such, would actually find more areas of conflict with the WCC than it would with the MWC schools. The WCC is a secular entity, and its motives in regards to membership are related to the unique niche that it has on the west coast, not affiliation with any particular faith or churches in general.
Also, the WCC has pursued Pacific, which is a non-demominational private university. (The Tigers were actually one of the original members of the WCC.)
And, I know that this has already been addressed, but travel is a major concern. Routine trips to Hawaii and New Mexico would be taxing on the budget and exhausting for the athletes.
I don't really buy the budget argument
BYU has a football team and its own network. While the Football team would be independent its revenues would still benefit sports other than football. In addition its network revenues bring in more money on top of that. I haven’t examined any numbers (nor do I know if that is possible with these private institutions) but I am willing to bit BYU’s athletic budget dwarfs that of other BYU members.
The fact that Zaninovich has made his intentions so public about his desire for BYU to become a member of our conference I think further solidifies that we are going after “church based” organizatioins. I haven’t heard anything about Pacific in recent months. I think that they too would be a quality addition to our league.
As far as travel is concerned I am not sure that argument holds water either. Provo is about 700 miles away from each of the WCC schools. Not exactly a puddle jump and not every school has a private plane that they can use like us. Yes its closer than Hawaii, but still not exactly close. Further the addition of a Utah State would allow schools a travel partner to help costs.
Correction
Last sentence of first paragraph: “I am willing to bet BYU’s atheltic budget dwarfs that of other WCC members”.
Yeah BYU would dwarf us in terms of revenue, its not even close
I started writing this as a joke but I kind of like it now… Maybe we should just join the WAC when they add new members such as Montana and whoever else (hopefully Eastern but that is biased). Then we can do what I have been dreaming about happening at Gonzaga and that is resurect its football program. We would make a lot more money and yes it would take 4-5 years to be competetive, and yes we would have to renovate Joe Alby or figure an alternate plan, and yes there would be other hurdles, but we would still get an automatic bid every year for basketball.
Haters start hating….
Why mess with success?
Gonzaga hasn’t lost a football game in over 50 years.
Seriously, is EWU football that big a money maker?
When I was at Carroll we used to play Whitworth. IIRC the crowd was mostly students and not a really big turnout either. We saw bigger crowds in Minot, ND and Butte, MT. Now that was many years ago and things may have changed.
How many scholarships would GU need to put up for Football? What are the start-up costs? Stadium — that won’t be cheap. What makes you think GU would do any better than Eastern in the $$$$ category?
mjc
mjc
I dont think Eastern will be a D1 football program, just wishful thinking
However the one thing I think Spokane is missing (this is evident by the success of the Shock) is a college football team in the city. There are over 300,000 people in Spokane and GU is the biggest sports team in the city.
I am a huge WSU fan…how many people really want to take a 2 hour trip to go to Pullman to watch a football game? How many people want to drive out to Cheney to see Eastern play D2 football?
If there was a D1 team that played its games in Spokane (renovated Joe Alby) and it was affordable, a GU football product would be a big seller. This wouldnt have to be an immediate thing either, I thnk the WAC has a 2 year grace period by the NCAA to field a football confrence with less than 7 teams so were talking 4 years from now.
I realize there are a lot of ifs but to me this would be huge for Gonzaga, Spokane and….. ME!
What a surprise....not
Reminds me of the ol, “When all is said and done, more is said than done.”
Its gonna be gLoRiOUS!!~
You know I am beginning to get the feeling that reporters sometimes talk to sources who have no knowledge of what is actually happening. Yesterday the Denver Post reported that BYU is going back to the MWC. But on the same day the San Jose Mercury News reported this:
“1. I’ve been told that BYU has reached out to the West Coast Conference about the possibility of placing its 18 teams that don’t play football into the WCC.
In the interest of full disclosure, let’s be clear: I’m not sure whether the Cougars will talk to WCC officials or meet in person with WCC officials. But according to a source, communication in some form will take place this week.
(I tried getting a comment/confirmation from WCC commish Jamie Zaninovich, who acknowledged last week that he had reached out to BYU. But Zaninovich did not respond to text or voice messages or to an email request for an interview.)
Assuming it’s true, it would be a significant development on two fronts:
Front one: Whatever ultimately happens with BYU, the WCC has scored major PR points simply for being in the discussion. And if the league actually lands the Cougars’ 18 teams, then it’s a Game 7 walk-off home run.
Front two: Best I can tell, it’s the first hard evidence since Fresno State and Nevada agreed to join the MWC that BYU is still actively pursuing football independence (because being independent in football, of course, means finding a home for its other teams)."
See thats the thing
I am not going to pretend that I know more than the the GU coaches who have coached and taught basketball for years. I can’t break down anyone’s crossover worth a damn. I do know a bit about business and thats why this conference talk and money issues are of great interest to me.
I wana hear about Wiltjer!!~
Oh thats right….he is making us all wait until at least September. groaaaaan.
In the meantime, lets refurbish Joe Abli and get that Gonzaga Bulldog Football program started. haha
Its gonna be gLoRiOUS!!~
by gaz-tastic on Aug 26, 2010 1:56 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Break down anyone's cross over?
..ummm…maybe you mean break anyone down with a crossover…???
Also, no offense…just would love to hear about Monninghoff….feels like a great unkown… ;)
Wow okay sorry . . . Break down anyone with a crossover
by opooos on Aug 26, 2010 2:28 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions
Seattle U
The Redhawks have joined the WCC for womens’ golf, effective immediately. Men’s basketball is likely on the horizon.
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